1745M outputs question

[jagulow]

Hello,

 

Cananyone tell me if the 5 XLR outputs on the1745’sbackoanel are SEPARATE or all wired together?

 

John

[jagulow]

Moreover, if they ARE wired separately, where do the remaining outputs go? I’d be running the input and one output (say, output # 1) thru one of my mixer (a Carvin MX1688)’s 2 built-in aux channels.

Also- if one of the modules happens to be the delay/flange/pitch module, does the accompanying Pitch Ratio knob take use output? I’m thinking it doesn’t because it’s just a control potentiometer.

JAGulow wrote:

Hello,

 

Can anyone tell me if the 5 XLR outputs on the1745’sbackoanel are SEPARATE or all wired together?

 

John

[jagulow]

All,

Please forgive my typos. I am experiencing lag on my computer. I’m correcting myself asI can!

John

 

JAGulow wrote:

Moreover, if they ARE wired separately, where do the remaining outputs go? I’d be running the input and one output (say, output # 1) thru one of my mixer (a Carvin MX1688)’s 2 built-in aux channels. The effects loop on the mixer already affects all 16 input channels, and there is one input on the 1745M, so why the multiple outputs?

Also- if one of the 5 modules on the 1745M happens to be a delay/flange/pitch module, does the accompanying Pitch Ratio control really use an output? I’m thinking it doesn’t, because it’s just a control potentiometer.

JAGulow wrote:

Hello,

 

Can anyone tell me if the 5 XLR outputs on the1745M’s back panel are SEPARATE or all wired together?

 

John

[rfactor]

The five XLR connectors represent the outputs of five separate, adjustable delay or pitch change cards.  Whatever you connect to the input is delayed by a variable amount by each card and then goes to the associated XLR output.  So, the XLRs are not wired "together."  The connectors that are not associated with a mainframe card will have no signal; the others will.

[jagulow]

Have I the privilege of conversing with THE Mr. Factor? Wow. Sir, I am thrilled to be writing to you. I cannot believe this! Here is my query.

I have been told, by Carvin, that my MX1688’s effects loop will affect all 16 input channels. I have 2 sets of effects loop controls within the Effects Master Strip, so I have 2 effects loops available. If I hook the 1745M’s input XLR jack into one of the board’s effect loop’s sends, and one of the 1745M’s 5 output XLRs, (say output #1, for aesthetics) to the corresponding effects loop’s return on the mixing board, I am now affecting all 16 of the board’s input channels with module 1, and only module 1,’s delay, yes?  Now- module 1 on the 1745M is a delay module. The 1745M’s other modules are (from right to left) 2) delay, 3) delay/flange/pitch, 4) the Pitch Ratio rotary knob and 5) delay.  Now that I know for certain that the Pitch Ratio knob has no output, or signal, of its own, where do I plug the 1745M’s other 3 module’s outputs on my board? Where you thinking of going through multiple mixing boards when you designed the 1745M?

Again, Mr. Factor- I am downright thrilled to be conversing with you.

Sincerely,

John Gulow

[rfactor]

jagulow wrote:

Have I the privilege of conversing with THE Mr. Factor? Wow. Sir, I am thrilled to be writing to you. I cannot believe this! Here is my query.

I have been told, by Carvin, that my MX1688's effects loop will affect all 16 input channels. I have 2 sets of effects loop controls within the Effects Master Strip, so I have 2 effects loops available. If I hook the 1745M's input XLR jack into one of the board's effect loop's sends, and one of the 1745M's 5 output XLRs, (say output #1, for aesthetics) to the corresponding effects loop's return on the mixing board, I am now affecting all 16 of the board's input channels with module 1, and only module 1,'s delay, yes?  Now- module 1 on the 1745M is a delay module. The 1745M's other modules are (from right to left) 2) delay, 3) delay/flange/pitch, 4) the Pitch Ratio rotary knob and 5) delay.  Now that I know for certain that the Pitch Ratio knob has no output, or signal, of its own, where do I plug the 1745M's other 3 module's outputs on my board? Where you thinking of going through multiple mixing boards when you designed the 1745M?

Again, Mr. Factor- I am downright thrilled to be conversing with you.

Sincerely,

John Gulow

 

Howdy!  Hope I'm doing this right – I'm not much of a poster, but then we get very few Qs about the 1745M!  I'm pleased that yours remains extant.

First, each module has one output.  The pitch change module is double-wide, but connects to only one XLR.  So, you really only have four output modules in the unit.  The theory, at least 40+ years ago, was that each output would connect to one input channel of your board, so you would have multiple copies of the 1745M input signal, each at a different delay (or pitch), each at a different amplitude, and, with panning, at a different location.  Presumably that's still what you can do with it today.  Beyond that, of course you can patch the outputs through other processing devices before going into the board.  Hope this answers your question.

And thanks for the personal comments!  Given how long I've been around, I'm thrilled to be conversing with anyone!  At the last AES in NYC I was wearing a badge that gave my title as "Prime Fossil."  

Richard

 

[jagulow]

Hello again, Mr. Factor-

So- I am not using the effects loop after all. I see. I am plugging into the input channels directly. The MX1688 can do this, however it’s my understanding, from Carvin, that I need to use both the in and the out jacks on any input channel. So- in order to have multiple patches, I would need multiple 1745Ms- using just 1 module from each DDL. I read that as I cannot use. say, the in and out on input channel 1, then connect just to the outs of any remaining input channels. I need to circle back with Carvin to verify that, though. So-  do the 1745M’s output xlrs 2-5 act as, sort of, “extentions” of output xlr 1? If not, wouldn’t there need to be 5 total input xlrs- to offset all 5 output xlrs?

As I was reading over the 1745M’s instruction manual, I found an interesting wrinkle. I noticed the I/O 3-pin xlr’s pinouts on page 4 are, regardless of being balanced or unbalanced, pin 1- analog ground, pin 2 – negative, and pin 3 – positive.  Present day 3-pin xlr pin out is pin 1 – ground, pin 2 – positive, pin 3 negative. Pins 1 & 2 on all the 1745M’s xlrs are 180 degrees out of phase with today’s xlr jacks. I got a wicked hum on power-up. My solution was to invert pins 1 & 2 on all cable (I’m using Hosa Technology balanced interconnect cables) jacks plugging into the 1745M- to, hopefully, solve the phase inversion problem, but I haven’t re-tested anything yet. I’ve also replaced the big C3 and C4 filter caps in the power section- in case they were the problem. I’m ready to replace BR1, BR2 and BR3 in the power section, if need be, as well. Do you agree with my solutions?

I noticed that you are a KISS fan. I am one, too- since mid ’70s. My 1745M was actually purchased from you, by Mr. Bill Aucoin, KISS’ manager back in the ’70s, for Gene Simmons, back in, I think it was, the mid to late ’70s. Do you remember anything about that device- or the transaction? It’s my intention to resuscitate my 1745M, and offer it to KISS tribute bands to use- for that extra little bit of realism, in their shows. I’ve asked the current staff at Little Ferry if they could find the original purchase receipt, so I could have a copy for the 1745M’s provenance, but no one there today knows where to look, or was even there, back in the ’70s. I have posted a couple of pictures of my 1745M, which you may view by clicking the ‘Eventide Gear’ bar under my forum avatar. I have many more, if you wish to see them. Again- I thank you SO much for taking the time to talk with me, sir. I am deeply honored.

Respectfully,

John

[jagulow]

I am getting a sound akin to that which a small, metal whistle (the kind which has a small ball bouncing around inside it) makes as output when I power up my 1745M. I’ve already replaced all 3 large filter caps in the power section (C3,C4,C5), with no evident fix. I’m now focusing on a suspicious-looking scorch mark on the PCB’s top surface, around the “+” via of BR1. Could, possibly, one (or more?) open diodes in any of these 3 bridge rectifiers also cause this shrill whistling? I’ve been doing a TON of reading on various troubleshoots, and I am steadfastly resolved to never give up on resuscitating my 1745M. Thank you very deeply for any assistance/advice rendered me.

Sincerely,

John G.

Caldwell, NJ

[jagulow]

I just got my treasured, 1977/1978, KISS-owned and toured Eventide Model 1745M, 4-tap DDL, with optional delay/flange/pitch module, unit back from Dane Beamish, owner of Beamish Electronics in Cleveland, OH. He had it diagnosed in one day! He had it working in two days!! It’s been fully bench tested, it passed its burn-ins (yup- twice!) with flying colors, and it is ready to live again!!! If ANYone needs their vintage Eventide gear repaired, I recommend Beamish Electronics in a half of a micronanosecond!!!!

[jagulow]

Hello,

I have a question on the 1745M, with regards to the Pitch Change Module. I know that the posted range of the PCM is +/- 1 octave. However- if the 1745M’s ‘2X’ switch is moved to the ‘on’ position, is the range of the PCM also, now, doubled to +/- 2 octaves?

[jagulow]

Wow! THE Mr. Factor- again! I would LOVE to just sit at your feet and absorb all your knowledge on this wonderful device you created! Thank you for replying! I’m a little confused, as the verbiage on page 22 of the 1745M’s manual is, to me- a rank novice, a bit misleading, as it says “there is no arbitrary limit on the pitch change obtainable”. Can you clarify for me, please? Thank you so very much, in advance.

John 

[jagulow]

Ah. I see. Thank you very much for clarifying that, Mr. Factor. I work in the Electrical Engineering department (Document Control divison) for a technologies company here in northern NJ, and I’ve learned to apply “air quotes” to, just about, everything I say to people at my workplace, when they ask, “Will my submission work?” The standard answer is, nearly always, “It should“!

All the best to you, Mr. Factor, and thank you all so very much for giving the world such wonderful devices!

John   

[jagulow]

Hello again. I finally got a mixing board for my 1745M, It’s a Samson MDR1064, with 10-channels. 6 mono and 2 stereo. It has 2 aux busses. I had a custom 4 XLRF-1/4″ plug combiner cable made, so that I could send the signals of all 4 output channels of my 1745M (3 straight delays and 1 delay/flange/pitch) simultaneously. I sent the combined signals into one of the 2 aux busses. The output was a highly confused (meaning I couldn’t control individual outputs) signal. So I unplugged the remaining 3 leads, and focused on just single module output. SUCCESS! My 1745M sprang into life. I started with the Delay/Flange/Pitch module. My question now is, how do I send the D/F/P module’s signal across multiple mixing board channels? Can I only go one 1745M module per mixing board channel? How can I apply, say, the Pitch Change function, across multiple channels of my mixing board? Do I send JUST the D/F/P signal into the aux busses?

[rfactor]

jagulow wrote:

Hello,

I have a question on the 1745M, with regards to the Pitch Change Module. I know that the posted range of the PCM is +/- 1 octave. However- if the 1745M's '2X' switch is moved to the 'on' position, is the range of the PCM also, now, doubled to +/- 2 octaves?

I don't remember.  (Sorry – 40 years ago!)  Most likely a 2X switch would have simply cut the sample rate in half without making other adjustments.  

Richard

 

[rfactor]

jagulow wrote:

Wow! THE Mr. Factor- again! I would LOVE to just sit at your feet and absorb all your knowledge on this wonderful device you created! Thank you for replying! I'm a little confused, as the verbiage on page 22 of the 1745M's manual is, to me- a rank novice, a bit misleading, as it says "there is no arbitrary limit on the pitch change obtainable". Can you clarify for me, please? Thank you so very much, in advance.

John 

I think you have to read it all together.  It is referring to how fast you can cycle (in either direction) through the RAM addresses.  Please, though, don't absorb my knowledge; not only is it growing obsolescent, but I think I would miss it more than you would enjoy it.

Richard

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