Cannot get Master / slave time clock to work

[lmlyons]

Hello all. Read through the forum, and documentation but I cannot seem to get midi time clock with 3, then 2 H9s to work. Most of the midi mappings are working. I am running an H9MAX in the front end of my system. It splits to two different amps. I then have an H9 in one amps effects loop and a another one in the second amp. I am using a GCP to send program changes successfully to each unit. The H9 MAX is the first of three in the midi chain. It also sends active/inactive CC messages successfully. So far, so good! i am also using a foot controller ( an Ernie Ball VP) and expression switch (BOSS FS5U) successfully – connected to the MAX. The footpedal works great with the wahwah app. I can see the numbers on the MAx go fro 0 to 100 with the footpedal, and I can see the tap tempo button bringing up rate changes in mS too. The H9MAX is working GREAT! So are the 2 other H9s. The GCP is perfect for them. So. I setup the MAX under midi settings / midi clock to no for enable input clock first prompt, no for the midi clock filter and yes to transmit the clock. For the second H9 in the chain I set receive clock to yes, no for the filter and yes to transmit the clock. The third in the midi chain to receive the clock, no to the filter and no to transmit. It’s the last in the midi cabling. All devices are set to thru. Remember cc and app changes are working great. But Time clock isn’t. So I stripped the system to its bare essentials. Just a MAX, a second H9, no GCP, no foot controller or tap tempo. Turned off each cc I had setup, and turned off the expression pedal mappings. Set up the MAX like above and the second H9 like the third one. I also did a reset. Tap tempo button on the MAX changes the tempo on the MAX but not the second H9. Oh. I dialed up multiple different echo algorithms just to see if that was it. Nope.

[LA Keys]

 

Here is the problem with your setup:

 

– If you set the H9  to midi thru it wil not send midi clock. Think of midi-thru as a “read-only” setting. Then this is what you need because you also want to pass thru (to the next H9) the information received from the GCP.

 

– If you set the H9 to “Transmit” it will transmit the midi clock, but will not pass (block) the received midi from the GCP

 

Do you see the problem ? 

 

 

You then have a few ways to solve this:

 

You can use a switch on the GCP for tap-tempo. Configure all the H9 as midi-thru and set “Midi settings” -> “Assign midi CC message to pedal function” -> “tap tempo” to the same CC you are sending from the GCP for the tap tempo (make sure it is momentary).

 

You can also use a midi merger/splitter (from midi-solution OR the m-audio midi sport 2×2 anniversary ed). There is an excellent post about this there:

 

https://www.eventideaudio.com/community/forum/stompboxes/ultimate-ptmfactor-control-musicomlab-mkiii

 

The best way to do this is shown on post #23

 

-You don’t need a merger and a splitter, just one box: the m-audio midisport 2×2 anniversary ed (has to be anniversary edition, the 4×4 will not work))

-The midi controller is your GCP

-The Factor pedals are your H9s

 

 

LA

 

 

 

[lmlyons]

Thank you LA Keys. I will most definitely try the tap tempo on a GCP IA button next and get back to you. The problem is, I don’t have an extra available to use given the current rack buildout, but I must test this so I will quickly configure one.

LL

[lmlyons]

Well. I could not get it to work. I then pulled the MAX H9 and another H9 out of the rack and ran a test just like the one last night. The GCP, exp switch and pedal and the 3rd H9 are out of the equation. Just the two pedals. I put the MAX into the preamp on a Marshal. I put the other H9 in the effects loop. I set the MAX unit to transmit, the other as thru. I set the MAX to no enable clock, no filter, yes to transmit. I set the other pedal to receive clock changes, to not filter, and to not transmit clock. Nothing else is in the midi picture. I dialed in pristine echo on both H9s. Hit tap tempo button on the max unit and no tap tempo is being sent. It’s just the two H9s. Tap tempo works as it should on the MAX.

[lmlyons]

Interesting. I can’t get the tap tempo button to work with either one of the regular H9’s as single stand alone units. The tap just increments the algo’s on both devices. I haven’t learned how the pedals physical interface works. The iPad apps tap works.

[lmlyons]

Well, that was very informative. It seems (I may be wrong), that when the second unit is in program inc/dec mode on the tap switch, it doesn’t respond to tempo changes. I have it working between devices, next up is to work through your notes LA Keys. Thank you for taking your time to respond. I do appreciate it!

LL

[LA Keys]

Here is what should work with 2 H9s (only). (This have been tested and done by many)

 

Both H9: Global tempo set to “NO”

 

First H9: (master)

– Midi output mode: “transmit”

– Enable Midi input clock: “NO”

– Enable Midi input Filter: “NO” (could also be set to yes as it is irrevelant)

– Enable Midi output clock: “YES”

 

Second H9: (slave)

– Midi output mode: “thru”

– Enable Midi input clock: “YES”

– Enable Midi input Filter: “NO” (could also be set to yes)

– Enable Midi output clock: “NO”

 

With this setup tapping a tempo on the first H9 will make it to send the midi clock to the second H9, which will adjust the tempo accordingly.

Note that the tap tempo is sent to the second H9 as a midi clock. (The “tap” itself is NOT sent)

Adding a 3rd H9 with the same setting as the 2nd one will also work.

 

But then this is not what you want to do when you will add the GCP in front of that… You have to understand that the GCP can’t send midi clock, it can just be configured to send a midi CC that could then be used by the H9s as a tap tempo. In this case all three H9s will be set the same way and none of them will send or receive a midi clock. They will all three internally generate the tempo from the received midi CC from the GCP.  This have also been done by many and I (and others) could help if you run into troubles with that.

 

LA

 

 

[lmlyons]

Thank You LA – I do understand all of it.  I also appreciate your help.   Placing order for the midi sport 2 x 2 ANNIVERSARY ADDITION right now.  Should get to me in a few days.

 

By the way – got the last example to work yesterday,  unless the slave H9 is set to incdec on the tap button.  For some reason,  if it is, the master H9’s tap does not get to the other H9.  Put the slave into tap tempo by holding down the tap button for a few seconds, and it works perfectly.  Hold that same button down for a few seconds to go back into incdec mode and it stops syncing to the masters midi time clock.  Don’t know why, but its good to have figured it out.  You know, the engineers at Eventide have really followed through on one of the toughest things to do in product development- draw up a spec and stick with it.  I haven’t run up against anything that could not be handled, even with a mildly complex setup.  I have multiple expression and volume pedals, multiple effects units (3 H9’s, and a few Lexi’s) , multiple amps, multiple controllers – and the Eventide products fit into all that connectivity just fine.    

 

I have everything now working in the rack with the GCP,  foot pedal controllers. Tap tempo to the last two H9’s is the last.   I cannot tell you all how AMAZING H9’s sound together in the front end, and effects loops combined on a multi amp setup.    While nothing is infinite when it comes to gear, this combination with a great midi foot controller, really gives me a pallet that is in one word – STUNNING.  

 

 

[LA Keys]

Great!

 

I don’t have much time to write tonight, but wanted to say that a “minor” annoyance of the midi sport 2×2 is that it is USB powered, not midi powered. This doesn’t mean you have to have it always plugged in a computer/tablet/etc, but if it is not you need to plug it to a usb power supply (with an usb cable). Funny thing is that I happen to use electronic cigarette (vaporizer) and lots of them use a 5V usb power supply, which I use sometimes when I’m not near my computer.

 

LA

[lmlyons]

Not a problem – I will add what it takes.   I really appreciate your help LA Keys.   I had the full performance system together and right now,  what I have is many factors times better than last years system. I was noodling around starting at noon on Sunday,  looked up and it was past 8pm..  That says it all…  I’ll respond back when I have the 2X2 installed.

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