Overload Issues and Levels

[mb]

I have set the H8000 FW's levels, as recommended by Eventide, to 0dB at all gain structures throughout the unit.
In fact, when a typical factory analog routing scheme, such as Parallel A and B or Serial A to B is loaded, 0dB is what you get throughout the entire unit… makes sense and good so far.

In my studio, all external FX units, are setup in the same way.
Eventide, as well as most manufacturers, always recommend bringing the source material's peak level fairly close to just below clipping at the pre A-to D converters inputs.
I adjust those levels from the source as recommended when possible but, rather than getting as close as possible to RED on the 8000, I prefer the first level of ORANGE LEDs, which appears to be approximately -6dB.

When DSP A and B are loaded with "Thru" (in Serial routing) and all levels are at unity, then I get exactly the same output. This is as it should be.
When conducting the same test in Parallel, I drop the outputs of DSP A and B by 3dB each so that the sum of both DSPs (at the analog outs) are 6 dB down and great, I get exactly the same results of -6dB at the outputs again! I also conducted this test using Oscillator preset 13 and got the same results.

I have stated the above in order to provide you with the understanding that I have a working knowledge regarding gain structure in the 8000.
However, when actually using the presets, it is curious to me that many of them have output levels that are way too high or even too low.

Of course, I do realize that with the many voices or signal paths in some presets, various EQ boosts, multi delay lines, revereration, etc. all of these things are adding to the gain on the outputs of that DSP.

However, some or many of those presets have no level controls available on the edit screen.
Vsig is not always practicle and if Eventide recommends close to max on inputs and also recommends NOT reducing gain other than at the POST D/A outputs, then we have far too many fluctuations in outputs levels unless we drop the levels from the source and that is only relative across the board.
Using vsig is not always an option nor should it be required as the ONLY way to do something that is as important as level optimization. I can always adjust this or that level in LEVELS or SETUP but, that would not make for consistant results accross most of the presets.
Why has Eventide nor tried to make these presets more uniform as it makes level management for too variable.

[IDeangelis]

 MB

to correctly set the input level:

when using analog inputs, the LEDs show headroom saturation. Since the 8000 has about +26dB input headroom, the top led would indicate +26dB over 0! You should only need to light up the first 4 LEDs to get the best signal/noise ratio.

When using digital signals, the top LEDs indicate the 0dB.

There may be different reasons why you can find some difference in levels in the presets:

-sometimes it's their own fx structures that can be very reactive to input transients (diffusors – ring modulators – preamps – etc.). These fx can result in very different levels according to the input source.

-some presets may not have levels control because they may be too large to include these in the algorithm. Since the unit has system levels, when needed…an option exists. 

-controlling system input levels via MIDI CCs is very effective in working situations.

best

I

[mb]

Italo:

Got it!… about the 26 over 0, that is. !!!
Ok that makes things alot easier.
Although, the manual does not lead one to this conclusion by stating that one should try to light up as close to 0 as possible.
Please consider an addendum to the manual. It is an important fact that you mentioned this. It is very important to make this very clear as you have just done hear, thanks

[ThreeFingersOfLove]

Hi,

I have asked something similar a little while ago. So I guess you are right, maybe the guys at Eventide need to change that part in the manual as it may lead to confusion.

Regards,
Yannis

[mb]

Agreed, Yannis.
And while we are at it, there are many, many things that need changing in the manual.

Italo, surely eventide needs to correct outright mistakes at the very least, as well, clarify things.
This is not a Japaneese product. NO EXCUSES for this!

[IDeangelis]

 Yes, the manual would benefit from a number of improvements and clarifications.

Hopefully this will handled soon.

best

I

[Author]

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