Pitchfactor tuner access & MIDI mapping of user presets

[gkellum]

nuno1959 wrote:

1 –  Between the Factors in bank mode + the MIDI Mouse's CC command inability, i'm pretty much stuck regarding access to the Pitchfactor's tuner.

I think the most recent PitchFactor release allows you to load the tuner with a program change message.  The most recent H9 release does, and they're built on the same code base…  I believe it should be assigned to program change 124 by default, but you should be able to change it in the MIDI program receive map to whatever you'd like.

But you could also get a single button aux switch.  The Boss FS-5U is one single button aux switch that we know should work.

nuno1959 wrote:

2 – The Nova being my oldest FX unit, i've got my user presets set in a certain order – usually bank 1/preset 1 is the intro of a song, bank 1/preset 2 the 2nd part, so on so forth..  

My trouble is, despite reading the manual or even trying a step by step approach, the MIDI implementation of the Factors seems to me so much more comprehensive ( & complex ?) than that of the Nova's that i can't figure out what/how exactly i should be ''mapping'' the presets to  MIDI Program Changes by the MIDI Mouse – specially if i need the same Pitch Bank nº/ user preset nº in several patches – will i need to make several repeat user presets to slot in in different locations ?

There are two ways you could go about this.  

One, you could change the PitchFactor's preset list so that the presets are matched up to the incoming program change messages.  You can have the same presets in different positions, and this can be done either on the PitchFactor itself or with H9 Control.  It might be a bit easier to set this up with H9 Control.  Here's a video that gives an overview of H9 Control's preset management, and it should be helpful for setting this up:  

Two, alternatively, PitchFactor has a program change receive map.  By default program change 1 loads preset 1.  Program change 2 loads preset 2 and so on.  But you could set program change 1 to load whatever preset you'd like.  So, you could leave your presets in the order they are currently in and that the program change receive map instead.  The program change receive map can be changed on the PitchFactor itself in system mode, and it can also be changed in H9 Control if you go to Pedal / MIDI Settings / Program Change receive map.

 

[nuno1959]

Hi guys

 Careful, total MIDI noob here – my experience in 54 years was buying a bunch of cables.. for somebody else !! Also as english is not my native language plz cut me some slack, my explanations will probably be long winded & not as clear as i could write in my own !  I’ve searched this forum, Google, read the manuals & can’t seem to find what i’m looking for.. 

I’m a bass player, building my fx board & my signal chain is :

1996 Status Graphite S1 Cassic 4 string  bass -> Boss FV 50 L volume pedal -> Eventide Pitchfactor -> TC Electronic Nova System -> Eventide Timefactor -> instr. input of Eden Nemesis RS 410 combo, etc.. Both Factors & Nova are in bank mode & have lots of user presets i’ve tweaked.

MIDI matters were supposed to be taken care of by a Tech21 MIDI Mouse which, as i recently found out, only sends Program Change commands & not CC commands, correct ?..  if curious take a peep :

https://www.flickr.com/photos/13706825@N03/albums/72157662183878740

Now i have 2 problems :

1 –  Between the Factors in bank mode + the MIDI Mouse’s CC command inability, i’m pretty much stuck regarding access to the Pitchfactor’s tuner.

After looking for a solution, i was wondering if there isn’t a SINGLE external switch i could buy or build.. that could plug either into the expression pedal ( & set it to ”trigger” the needed CC comand ? ) or aux switch inputs & when clicked on would just access the tuner after assigning it to do so & that being possible, would i need to program the Pitchfactor to obey this ?  Something maybe like this :

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/131673097580?_trksid=p2055119.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/131684384957?_trksid=p2055119.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

 to use instead of these :

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/DigiTech-FS3X-Three-Function-Foot-Switch-/311296678808?hash=item487aba5b98:g:k0AAAOSwdpxUWTCq

http://www.thomann.de/gb/digitech_fs300.htm

This problem is not a tragedy but why use an extra Korg tuner/power supply/cables when i have a SUPER FINE tuner already in place ?

 

Next, a bit more complicated

2 – The Nova being my oldest FX unit, i’ve got my user presets set in a certain order – usually bank 1/preset 1 is the intro of a song, bank 1/preset 2 the 2nd part, so on so forth..  

  When i bought the Factors ( Pitch & later Time.. ) i tweaked some new user presets to use simultaneously with the Nova’s presets in order to create new or finer versions of what i had

  When i only had the Pitch, i used the H9 Control app/playing at home while getting the hang of the pedal but now i’d like to do it via my board/MIDI Mouse so i need to re-order some of the Pitch & Time presets so they ”match” the right order in the Nova’s presets – am i making sense ?

  For example let’s pretend this is the 1st tune to play :

http://www.wikiloops.com/backingtrack-jam-56527.php   I power my board, MIDI Mouse comes on at nº1 & the Pitch should power at say.. bank 1/user preset 1, the Nova at bank 3/preset 2 & the Time in bypass. Now, 1.20 minute into the jam i need to access another sound ( in this case a tweaked version of the previous.. ) so i press the MIDI Mouse up switch (to nº2) to tell the Pitch to go to bank X /user preset Y, the Nova to stay as is & the Time to go to whatever/whatever.. only to come back at 1.52 to the previous patch, then the same later at 3.20/3.43..

My trouble is, despite reading the manual or even trying a step by step approach, the MIDI implementation of the Factors seems to me so much more comprehensive ( & complex ?) than that of the Nova’s that i can’t figure out what/how exactly i should be ”mapping” the presets to  MIDI Program Changes by the MIDI Mouse – specially if i need the same Pitch Bank nº/ user preset nº in several patches – will i need to make several repeat user presets to slot in in different locations ?

  If this was possible to do via the H9 Control app, it would be GREAT : sorry, i LOVE the factors for their unbelievable FX quality & if stolen, would buy another in a heartbeat but i really dislike the ”press these 2, then press the other” type of access to menus – it confuses me & i just loose track what i’m doing/where i am, can’t explain.. 

 I realise that trying to make MIDI implementations simple enough for noobs like me yet powerful for advanced MIDI users must be a total headache !!

Finally, allow me a few feature suggestions :

1 – access to tuner in either play or bank mode..

2 – be able to do what i described above in nº2 via H9 Control app – unless it already is & i haven’t realised it ? 

3 – when multiple Factors are in use/connected via USB to computer, allow H9 Control to open several windows by maybe double clicking on the pedal’s thumbnail in the left ? One window per pedal, to avoid the going back & forth & be able to keep track on what was selected in the other(s) pedal ?..

4 – be able to re-order presets by simply clicking & dragging them to their new, desired position – the Zoom B3 app allowed this & it took about 5 to 10 minutes to get it done then if i remember correctly i just hit save & the pedal itself would be ordered that way even unplugged form the computer

Thank you VERY much for the patience & sorry if i wrote something obnoxiously MIDI ignorant ( yup, that’s me !! ) Cheers guys, much appreciated

Nuno

[nuno1959]

Hi GK

& thank you so much for your fast reply – much appreciated !!

nº1 – am checking out that Boss switch immediately ! 😉

nº2 – Basically what you’re saying is for me to make a Preset List, placing the FX presets in my desired order & then save to the pedal, right ?  

As in attached photo..

That being the case, it would be SO much easier for me, fantastic !!

[gkellum]

nuno1959 wrote:

nº2 – Basically what you're saying is for me to make a Preset List, placing the FX presets in my desired order & then save to the pedal, right ?  

Yes, that's how I'd do it.  It's seems easier to understand and keep track of then changing the MIDI receive map.

[nuno1959]

….What did i tell you !? Total noob here for SURE :

Tried the MIDI Mouse’s down button  to 124 & sure enough – the Pitchfactor’s tuner came up immediately !!! Glorious… 😉

Now i’m sure the Preset List feature will sort me totally, fantastic !

Thanks a bunch 

 

[nuno1959]

Hi Gk

Re- the tuner :

I may have cried victory a little too soon ! Going down to 124 on the MIDI Mouse does bring up the word tuner in the Pitch’s screen but.. i just plugged my bass & tried it & it doesn’t work nor can i access it by pressing anything further on the pedal itself – any clues why this could be happening ? Maybe some setting on the H9 app ?

Thanks

Nuno

[gkellum]

nuno1959 wrote:

I may have cried victory a little too soon ! Going down to 124 on the MIDI Mouse does bring up the word tuner in the Pitch's screen but.. i just plugged my bass & tried it & it doesn't work nor can i access it by pressing anything further on the pedal itself – any clues why this could be happening ? Maybe some setting on the H9 app ?

You're sure that you are plugged into Input 1 on the PitchFactor?  I'm not sure if the tuner will work if you're plugged into Input 2.  

Also, there should be a Source Instrument setting in Pedal Settings.  You'll want to set that to Bass.  Basses go lower in frequency that guitars, and if you are hitting the bottom string on the bass, the tuner might not work if the source instrument is set to guitar.

[nuno1959]

Hi Gk

Thanks for your input, on a sunday of all days… 😉 appreciated !!

Yes, i have the Pitchfactor connected via it’s intput one ( the mono one.. ) i have bass as selected source instrument in the Settings & all i get is as shown on the attached photo – the word TUNER & nothing i tried gets anything happening, the word just sits there, starring at me, as if mocking my frustration !!…LOL…

As soon as i get the MIDI Mouse to move to nº1 for example, the Pitchfactor changes into a bank/preset as it should & it plays fine so i can only think that maybe i selected something i shouldn’t have but can’t figure out what – plz check the photo montage i made here ( tried but this website wouldn’t upload my pic.. )

https://www.flickr.com/photos/13706825@N03/23621106499/in/dateposted-public/lightbox/

A is General Settings, B is Program Change Receive Map (124 is set as Activate the pedal ), C is MIDI settings ( receive channel set to 1.. all pedals are on same receive channel), D is the various alternatives available for Program change 124 & one can’t see it in the photo but goes up till 99

When i hit a string, the word tuner just sits there…….

 

 

[nickrose]

If it just sits at "TUNER", this means that it is not seeing your instrument.

The fact that you are using a bass may be relevant – I don't know from memory how far down it goes.  Try playing some of the higher notes and see if you get a reaction.

Also, make sure it is getting a good signal level,

 

[nuno1959]

NR, thanks for pitching in !

For example my Nova’s tuner is useless with bass but that was a pleasant surprise it wasn’t the case w/ the Pitch’s tuner, when i bought it it was a feature i tried right away & it worked flawlessly : no problem whatsoever all the way down to my open E string & SO precise, the tracking on this thing is SUPERB !                                

I do have bass as selected source instrument, have tried it just now in play mode & had no issues tuning, all good.. However in bank mode it still won’t & going down to 124 on the M.Mouse it still just shows the word TUNER !                                      

Now to be honest, i’ve realised when i tried setting the Pitch in Play Mode, tune the bass then move back to Bank Mode & play the bass ( 1 click to change Modes + 1 click on 2 buttons enter Tuner + 1 back to Bank Mode.. )  that it was more effort clicking down on the MIDI Mouse from nº1 down to 124 ( 5 clicks in total.. )  my real hope was to be able to set the Pitch’s tuner from slot 124 up to nº 128, right below nº1 & then yes, that would be a simple yet polished way to tune :                                                         1 click down, tune, 1 click up to patch nº1 & play. 

If this is  a capability of the pedal, i would really appreciate you guys keep helping me sorting whatever is stopping it from doing so but if it would have to stay at 124, i can perfectly live w/ accessing the tuner by going into Play Mode & then back, no problem..

Cheers

[gkellum]

nuno1959 wrote:

If this is  a capability of the pedal, i would really appreciate you guys keep helping me sorting whatever is stopping it from doing so but if it would have to stay at 124, i can perfectly live w/ accessing the tuner by going into Play Mode & then back, no problem..

I asked one of our testers to see if he could reproduce the problem you've been having loading the tuner with a MIDI program change.  We'll see what he says and take it from there…

[nuno1959]

Thanks GK

 

I really appreciate it !

[nuno1959]

Don’t ask me how but i got the tuner working via the MIDI Mouse, strange thing is i have to go down to 124 on it, the word TUNER appears on display but doesn’t tune, then go up to 125 for it to actually ”engage” & tune – but it does !!

Neat !!..

[gkellum]

nuno1959 wrote:

Weird! 

[nuno1959]

gkellum wrote:

nuno1959 wrote:

Weird! 

If this is all the MIDI Gremlin Gods will do, i definitely can live with it !!…LOL…

& one more thing solved… 😉

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