Pre/post setup mode question

[tnjazz]

OK, I just discovered Pre/Post mode as an option and I’m excited to try this but what I’d like to do I’m not sure is possible. Can anyone advise?

I have 2 H9’s and a favorite overdrive, and an amp with an FX loop. I would like to hook everything up so that I have the pre/post options below:

 

H9 #1 before overdrive in front

H9 #1 after overdrive in front

H9 #1 in loop

H9 #2 in front (after H9 #1 and overdrive)

H9 #2 in loop

 

Is it possible to have both H9’s available both before the amp and in the loop, AND also still have the overdrive available in front of the amp while BOTH H9’s are using post presets in the FX loop?

[tnjazz]

OK, so I did some experimenting last night and here’s where I currently am:

guitar input -> H9#1 input 1

H9#1 output 1 -> compressor -> overdrive -> H9#2 input 1

H9#2 output 1 -> amp input

H9#1 input 2 -> fx loop in

H9#1 output 2 -> H9#2 input 2

H9#2 output 2 -> fx loop out

 

Here are my questions:

What happens when both of the H9’s are bypassed? Is the default routing input/output 1? I would like the signal to go straight into the front of the amp with both H9’s off.

If I engage both H9’s, pre sends the signal to the front of the amp and post sends it to the fx loop?

If I engage only the first H9, does it follow the same path as above? what if I only engage H9 #2?

 

All of this is because the harmonizer presets sound like absolute garbage in my loop, and I need to make them useable. However, I prefer the majority of my fx in the loop, particularly reverbs and delays. So my first H9 does most of my harmonizing, along with wah and some modulation and my second H9 does some modulation and all of my delays and verbs.

Any help or suggestions would be most appreciated! Again, in a perfect world my goal is to have both pre and post options by preset on both H9’s, and ALSO have the option to send either or both to either the front of the amp or to the fx loop, or send presets on H9 #1 to the front and presets on H9#2 to the loop. I think I have the first two with this setup, but is the third option viable? I’m not clear enough on the routing defaults to know…

[tnjazz]

For the sake of clarity, I found this in a post from last year. His question however did not appear to have been answered (and is essentially the same as mine).

The attached graphic is how my H9’s are setup at the moment, although I have a comp and an OD between 3 and 5.

[nickrose]

What happens when both of the H9's are bypassed? Is the default routing input/output 1? I would like the signal to go straight into the front of the amp with both H9's off.

If you use relay bypass it will connect each input to the corresponding output. So, this will connect the guitar to the amp, but it will also connect the effect loop input to the effect loop output. You probably don't want this, but have no choice when the unit is off.

You will usually use DSP Bypass when the unit is on. There is no real concept of a default routing – it depends on whether you are in PRE or POST mode, and whether Killdry is on.

The problem here is that PRE/POST when used with a parallel effects loop is difficult when you use more than one effect unit – this is not our fault, it's the nature of the beast.

Here follows the UM definition of PRE/POST operations:

PRE – a mono signal sent to input 1 is routed through the effect to output 1, while input 2 is passed unchanged to output 2.

If KillDry is set, output 2 will be muted. When Bypassed, output 1 will always be dry.

POST – a mono signal sent to input 2 is routed through the effect to output 2, while input 1 is passed unchanged to output 1.

When Bypassed, if KillDry is set, output 2 will be muted. Output 1 will always be dry.

Your problem here is that if KillDry is set on either unit, if either unit is in PRE or bypassed, the effects loop send (output 2) will be lost.

If KillDry is not set, it will do what you want, except that if both units are bypassed, you will get feedback around the effects loop – not good.

So, your other questions:

If I engage both H9's, pre sends the signal to the front of the amp and post sends it to the fx loop?

Yes, if KillDry is off.

If I engage only the first H9, does it follow the same path as above? what if I only engage H9 #2?

See the above discussion – depends on KillDry.

 

Sorry – as I mentioned earlier, this gets difficult with more than one effect.

 

[TomGit]

nickrose wrote:

What happens when both of the H9’s are bypassed? Is the default routing input/output 1? I would like the signal to go straight into the front of the amp with both H9’s off.

If you use relay bypass it will connect each input to the corresponding output. So, this will connect the guitar to the amp, but it will also connect the effect loop input to the effect loop output. You probably don’t want this, but have no choice when the unit is off.

You will usually use DSP Bypass when the unit is on. There is no real concept of a default routing – it depends on whether you are in PRE or POST mode, and whether Killdry is on.

The problem here is that PRE/POST when used with a parallel effects loop is difficult when you use more than one effect unit – this is not our fault, it’s the nature of the beast.

Here follows the UM definition of PRE/POST operations:

PRE – a mono signal sent to input 1 is routed through the effect to output 1, while input 2 is passed unchanged to output 2.

If KillDry is set, output 2 will be muted. When Bypassed, output 1 will always be dry.

POST – a mono signal sent to input 2 is routed through the effect to output 2, while input 1 is passed unchanged to output 1.

When Bypassed, if KillDry is set, output 2 will be muted. Output 1 will always be dry.

Your problem here is that if KillDry is set on either unit, if either unit is in PRE or bypassed, the effects loop send (output 2) will be lost.

If KillDry is not set, it will do what you want, except that if both units are bypassed, you will get feedback around the effects loop – not good.

So, your other questions:

If I engage both H9’s, pre sends the signal to the front of the amp and post sends it to the fx loop?

Yes, if KillDry is off.

If I engage only the first H9, does it follow the same path as above? what if I only engage H9 #2?

See the above discussion – depends on KillDry.

 

Sorry – as I mentioned earlier, this gets difficult with more than one effect.

 

Hi

I wanna pick up an old topic which seams to be not solved until today even in my opinion it should be possibel.

Im using the standard H9  pre/post configuraion in my setup.

Guitar -> input 1 -> output 1 -> Amp

Parallel FX send -> input 2 -> output2 -> parallel FX return

Killdry is turned on

The way how H9 works is fully understood. If I’m using the relay bypass, everything works fine with the restrction that there is a hard cut of the effect signals and sometime depending on the effect there is a switching noise. But I don’t face any feedback.

What I don’t understood is why is it not possible to implement the DSP(+FX) bypass in the same way like the (hardwired) relay bypass )or at least to have an option to configure it accordingly in the H9 (tool) ?

I would really appreciated it if it could be available within the next software release !!! Many thanks.

 

 

 

 

[TomGit]

TomGit wrote:

nickrose wrote:

What happens when both of the H9’s are bypassed? Is the default routing input/output 1? I would like the signal to go straight into the front of the amp with both H9’s off.

If you use relay bypass it will connect each input to the corresponding output. So, this will connect the guitar to the amp, but it will also connect the effect loop input to the effect loop output. You probably don’t want this, but have no choice when the unit is off.

You will usually use DSP Bypass when the unit is on. There is no real concept of a default routing – it depends on whether you are in PRE or POST mode, and whether Killdry is on.

The problem here is that PRE/POST when used with a parallel effects loop is difficult when you use more than one effect unit – this is not our fault, it’s the nature of the beast.

Here follows the UM definition of PRE/POST operations:

PRE – a mono signal sent to input 1 is routed through the effect to output 1, while input 2 is passed unchanged to output 2.

If KillDry is set, output 2 will be muted. When Bypassed, output 1 will always be dry.

POST – a mono signal sent to input 2 is routed through the effect to output 2, while input 1 is passed unchanged to output 1.

When Bypassed, if KillDry is set, output 2 will be muted. Output 1 will always be dry.

Your problem here is that if KillDry is set on either unit, if either unit is in PRE or bypassed, the effects loop send (output 2) will be lost.

If KillDry is not set, it will do what you want, except that if both units are bypassed, you will get feedback around the effects loop – not good.

So, your other questions:

If I engage both H9’s, pre sends the signal to the front of the amp and post sends it to the fx loop?

Yes, if KillDry is off.

If I engage only the first H9, does it follow the same path as above? what if I only engage H9 #2?

See the above discussion – depends on KillDry.

 

Sorry – as I mentioned earlier, this gets difficult with more than one effect.

 

Hi

I wanna pick up an old topic which seams to be not solved until today even in my opinion it should be possibel.

Im using the standard H9  pre/post configuraion in my setup.

Guitar -> input 1 -> output 1 -> Amp

Parallel FX send -> input 2 -> output2 -> parallel FX return

Killdry is turned on

The way how H9 works is fully understood. If I’m using the relay bypass, everything works fine with the restrction that there is a hard cut of the effect signals and sometime depending on the effect there is a switching noise. But I don’t face any feedback.

What I don’t understood is why is it not possible to implement the DSP(+FX) bypass in the same way like the (hardwired) relay bypass )or at least to have an option to configure it accordingly in the H9 (tool) ?

I would really appreciated it if it could be available within the next software release !!! Many thanks.

Sorry I made a mistake.

Parallel FX send -> input 2 -> output2 -> parallel FX return

should be

Parallel FX send -> input 2 -> output2 -> Timefactor input1 -> Timefactor output1 -> parallel FX return

[tnjazz]

Ok, thanks for the info!

Kill dry is off on both units. I am using DSP+FX bypass on both as well.

So if I understand you correctly, if H9 #1 is using an effect set to pre, it will go to the front of the amp regardless of how the second H9 is set? Meaning, if it is using a post effect then THAT will go to the loop while the other goes to the front?

So my only problem arises if I happen to bypass both units simultaneously? Is there any way to work around that?

[nickrose]

Sounds like you have the picture !

Last question – sorry, no solution I can see, unless you can shut off your effects loop at the same time.

 

 

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