Split: Split: Changing Presets via MIDI

[boyce89976]

I have one too.

The H90 can run two algorithms, but you can’t independently control, or change, the algorithms via midi.  This is a big miss.  I was hoping the H90 could replace my Bigsky and Timefactor as my delay and reverb, but I don’t see how that’s possible without creating an overly complex preset list.  Instead, it’s more of a modulation/octaves replacement, which is disappointing with such a capable (in other ways) pedal.

[joecozzi]

If what you mean is that you can’t change to a different preset within a Program via MIDI, then you are correct; however, all aspects of both presets within a Program can be manipulated via MIDI. All of them. With that being said, with true spillover, what is the complication of just switching to a new program with varying presets if it’s seamless?

[joecozzi]

One of the reasons switching presets within a Program is not possible is because every time you create a preset the H90 adds it to an alphanumeric list. Adding and subtracting presets is always an amorphous process. Unlike creating programs, they live on a dedicated Program list, easily accessible on a stagnant list of Programs; it’s harder to fudge with the order of your MIDI programming. It’s rock solid actually.

[boyce89976]

joecozzi wrote:

If what you mean is that you can’t change to a different preset within a Program via MIDI, then you are correct; however, all aspects of both presets within a Program can be manipulated via MIDI. All of them. With that being said, with true spillover, what is the complication of just switching to a new program with varying presets if it’s seamless?

Since I was hoping to replace a delay and reverb, unless I’m not thinking about it correctly, I’d have to set up programs like this if I want to change reverbs without changing delays:

1. Short Hall
   1. .8th delay
   2. 8th delay
   3. 8th into .8th delay
   4. .8th into 1/4 delay
   5. 1/4 delay
2. Modulated Plate
   1. .8th delay
   2. 8th delay
   3. 8th into .8th delay
   4. .8th into 1/4 delay
   5. 1/4 delay

Is there a better way to do it?

[joecozzi]

I’m trying to understand what you mean here. Can we think about it in terms of a Program that consists of two algorithms? Are what you are calling #1 and #2 algorithm A and algorithm B? Are a, b, c, d, and e values you want to achieve via MIDI?

[joecozzi]

I think I understand what you mean, tell me if I got it:

First program is a short Hall match with a .8th delay
2nd – Short hall going into a 8th delay
3rd – Short hall going into a dual delay with 8th and .8th delay
4th – Short hall going into a dual delay with .8th and 1/4 delay
etc.

[boyce89976]

joecozzi wrote:

I’m trying to understand what you mean here. Can we think about it in terms of a Program that consists of two algorithms? Are what you are calling #1 and #2 algorithm A and algorithm B? Are a, b, c, d, and e values you want to achieve via MIDI?

Right, so if I want to change reverbs, and have access to all of my delay subdivisions, I would need to create a program where A is the reverb I want, and B is the delay subdivision.  For Delay continuity I would need a program with every delay configuration for each reverb preset I want.  Does that make sense?

[boyce89976]

joecozzi wrote:

I think I understand what you mean, tell me if I got it: First program is a short Hall match with a .8th delay2nd – Short hall going into a 8th delay3rd – Short hall going into a dual delay with 8th and .8th delay4th – Short hall going into a dual delay with .8th and 1/4 delayetc.

 

Exactly.  Maybe I’m missing something, but that seems like the only solution if the H90 is to be your delay and reverb pedal?

[joecozzi]

Ok, now that I understand what you mean, let’s look at this way. In your example, you have 8 programs.

Short Hall &.8th delay
Short Hall & 8th delay
Short Hall & 8th into .8th delay
Short Hall & .8th into 1/4 delay
Short Hall & 1/4 delay
Modulated Plate & .8th delay
Modulated Plate & 8th delay
Modulated Plate & 8th into .8th delay
Modulated Plate & .8th into 1/4 delay
Modulated Plate & 1/4 delay

As you switch from one program to the next, the reverb will stay constant, but the delay trails of the previous program will continue to trail out as you play along with the subdivision of the new delay time. It’s actually more seamless than switching to a different delay preset which would cause the delay to immediately change subdivisions as it’s trailing out.

[apalazzolo]

Of course, Joe is correct but it seems to me there are other ways to skin this cat.

If you have five reverbs and one delay, Joe’s example results in 25 programs right there.  A List can have up to 99 programs. If you are coordinating 5 reverbs and four delays.  That’d be 100 programs, no?

If I am not mistaken, the OP could set his H90 up for six aux switches and use midi to control seven time divisions per program as follows:

PROGRAM1: REVERB1 and DELAY1 w/time div1

AUX1 substitutes time div2 in place of time div1

AUX2 substitutes time div3 in place of time div1

AUX3 substitutes time div4 in place of time div1

AUX4 substitutes time div5 in place of time div1

AUX5 substitutes time div6 in place of time div1

AUX6 substitutes time div7 in place of time div1

You would then use  midi commands to make the AUX switches operate like radio buttons.

One reverb and one delay is only one program.  Five reverbs and four delays is only 20 programs.

If you only need four time divisions, this is even easier using hotswitches because they already operate as radio buttons.  Plus, all of this switching can be done without midi, using the three switches on the pedal itself.

This much is true isn’t it?

The part that I know I don’t understand is that the OP seems to want serial delays.  For example, “.8th into 1/4”.  If he uses one of the two algo slots for a reverb, where is he going to find one algo with two serial delays?  Is there a delay algo with serial delays?  Have I missed that?

 

 

[brock]

apalazzolo wrote:

… The part that I know I don’t understand is that the OP seems to want serial delays. For example, “.8th into 1/4”. If he uses one of the two algo slots for a reverb, where is he going to find one algo with two serial delays? Is there a delay algo with serial delays? Have I missed that?

FilterPong (minus the filter)?  Barring serial, one could tighten it all up to one algo with SpaceTime.

Nice writeup on consolidation, BTW.  That’s rack-thinking (appropriate with the H90).

[joecozzi]

apalazzolo wrote:

If you have five reverbs and one delay, Joe’s example results in 25 programs right there.

Not sure how you came up with 25 presets when I literally listed all the combinations OP wanted. 😅

[apalazzolo]

joecozzi wrote:

apalazzolo wrote:

If you have five reverbs and one delay, Joe’s example results in 25 programs right there.

Not sure how you came up with 25 presets when I literally listed all the combinations OP wanted.

All I meant was that solving the problem by creating a different program for each reverb and each time division results in 10 programs for the OP’s specific example.

But if one wanted to do this for five favorite reverbs instead of two, you’d need 25 programs to cover that.

Just different ways to skins the cat, and they are many (ways) here.

The real problem here seems to be that I don’t know of any dual-series delay algorithms I think the OP would need to achieve his 1c. 1d. 2c and 2d examples.

 

 

[apalazzolo]

Is FilterPong a true dual-series delay?  I recall some talk of that but I thought that only the delay times could be added together serially to double the delay time of a single delay.  Did I get that wrong?

[joecozzi]

Yes, it is a serial delay, but the algorithm is unique in that even though it’s a serial delay, the delays are individually panned to separate outputs. Not so in mono, but the serial test is obvious when you set a long delay time for A and short delay time for B; we don’t hear B until A’s delay time is completed.

[boyce89976]

Thanks for the ideas, guys.  Trying to figure out if an H90 is in my future, and this was very helpful!

[joecozzi]

Just to further add to apalazzolo’s great ideas, the H90 also features three hotswitches in PERFORM mode, so you can achieve up to three different delay subdivision settings per Program. In fact, if you wanted to, each Hotswitch can change any set of parameters across the entire Program (both algorithms) instantaneously. Using them in combination with Aux switches is very powerful.

[apalazzolo]

You can actually achieve up to four different delay subdivision settings per program/preset using the three hotswitches alone.

div1=no HS

div2=HS1

div3=HS2

div4=HS3

 

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